00:14	#
00:22	#
00:26	Mm?
00:34	Right #.
00:39	$
00:41	Oh forgot my pen oh well I d- don't need it anyway. No.
00:44	$
00:49	Oh my screen is small again, well, doesn't matter a lot. Yeah I know.
00:52	Yeah, here is what to do.
00:54	Mm.
00:55	#
00:57	But I can read it like -
00:59	Right.
01:00	Great man. Who starts?
01:04	Well I'll uh start just with another presentation, so then we can uh look at th- at the agenda uh for this meeting.
01:07	Alright, great.
01:10	Alright.
01:13	$ Okay.
01:16	I've put some uh new things in the in the (map).
01:19	Mm-hmm.
01:21	Uh oh. #
01:23	This is it.
01:25	I don't know the shortcut so - Ah F_ five. Well our functional design meeting, that's the stage we're in, and you also ha- all three of you have uh prepared something about it.
01:33	Mm-hmm.
01:38	Yes.
01:39	Well um in- we'll (the) just have a look at the at the notes from the previous meeting, what we uh thought we had dec- decided but uh -
01:41	#
01:50	Uh then we'll uh look at the the three uh presentations uh from you.
01:57	'Kay.
01:57	I think you have prepared uh all three uh? $ Um we'll look at th- the new project requirements we uh - I dunno (y-) you also have uh received that mail, the new project requirements from our bosses?
01:59	Well, yeah.
02:00	Yeah.
02:11	No.
02:11	No. You're the only one. $
02:12	Oh I've received a mail with uh some additional requirements and I'll have a look if - well I think we should show them before your presentations because it's not really uh
02:16	Oh.
02:16	Alright.
02:23	smart uh to uh to include some things uh we can't because of the new requirements. Well um then we can make some decisions about our remote control functions. We have to (d- b-) we have to decide it in this meeting what our function will be.
02:29	'Kay.
02:39	And then uh we can discuss uh some more (closely). Uh -
02:43	We have forty minutes for this uh -
02:45	Uh yeah I think so. $ Well uh (??) the closing uh we'll not uh look at it yet.
02:48	Alright.
02:54	#
02:54	Alright.
02:55	Uh (I'll) now I'll look at (??) show (it at uh) this board.
03:04	Um.
03:06	Well uh (notes, first) meeting.
03:11	Now.
03:12	I gave a disc- a a presentation. Uh we familiarized ourself with the boards and then we discussed some first ideas. So
03:22	we said that uh
03:24	we have to merge the strong points from our uh competitors, and uh look at their uh remote controls. We should make it uh compatible with our new D_V_D_ and other releases we have - our technical releases. Uh not too many (??) buttons. One recognisable button in the middle where you do the most important functions with, and um well they can have two functions because uh you have a D_V_D_ and a television.
03:28	Right.
03:36	Uh-huh.
03:39	#
03:49	Yeah.
03:50	Um the design has to fit the hand, be original but also be familiar.
03:56	$ It's uh (one of our ideas). $ Yeah well (that wa-) it's just thirty minutes ago, it's not quite uh, $ but well uh I have to do it. The materials uh well should be hard plastic with rubber from (??), and uh well the labeling of the buttons should be indestructible. It should be uh recognisable at all times. Yes. Well fronts were to be (??) just like mobile telephones.
03:58	$
03:59	$
04:03	$ Yeah.
04:03	Mm-hmm, now it's right.
04:13	#
04:14	That (??) easily wiped out, (??).
04:16	Mm.
04:16	Okay.
04:21	And uh the technical aspects um - and also labeling of the buttons, the functions should be universal standards. Well that's just uh some ideas from the first meeting. It's quite logical al- all of it.
04:30	Mm-hmm.
04:35	Um now the new project requirements, I'll just show them. I got this mail
04:40	from uh our bosses. Well, teletext goes out. We will not use teletext.
04:48	Okay.
04:49	I I disagree, but uh it's not uh t- it's not my place to disagree I guess.
04:49	Maybe a new sort of thing but n- but not teletext. Well -
04:54	the second is a bit
04:58	sh- pity because we just said we wanted to d- include the D_V_D_ and they don't want it because of our time we have for this project.
05:00	Oh.
05:03	Alright.
05:06	Oh, alright.
05:07	That's a shame.
05:07	So that's a shame because uh especially for the third requirement we want to reach people under the thirty years
05:16	because uh we don't have those customers a lot (at th- at this) point. Um well it's a bit pity because* (i- it's) just those people (who) want to have uh one remote control for all those technical devices they can uh reach it.
05:27	Yeah.
05:28	(??) forget about it. It's just time consuming, so we uh have to go on.
05:30	Yeah.
05:31	#
05:32	Well and uh our corporate image should stay rec- recognisable in our products, so uh we have to uh use uh maybe a slogan maybe a colour and um - Yeah well uh on our remote controls the design has to be uh well as we already said a- actually familiar. Uh not only just uh the shape but also our company.
05:50	Yes.
05:58	Yeah, we are uh # we (??) fashionable company I read uh I read it on the - I didn't know what company we were but we we design uh especially trendy uh trendy trendy stuff, so it has to be uh a modern design. That's important to know uh when you design a thing (??).
06:02	$ Yeah.
06:03	Mm.
06:04	$
06:09	Okay.
06:13	Yes I I uh noted uh our uh slogan that we have, our company, it's uh we mm put the fashion in electronics.
06:22	Nah.
06:23	Right.
06:23	So maybe that's a slogan we can put uh somewhere on our remote control or something. Alright then um we're going to uh have three presentations. You want to start? $ Oh you have to start? I didn't see anything about uh who had to start. Well s- then* start.
06:27	Yeah.
06:31	Yeah.
06:33	$
06:33	Yeah # I think I have to start $. Oh no i- no problem. I I just have to uh to think which file's mine, 'cause I was uh bit in a hurry.
06:38	The order, no -
06:44	Okay. Well uh -
06:46	I think it's this one.
06:49	But I'm not sure.
06:54	(??).
06:59	Oh (??) you already uh opened uh PowerPoint.
07:01	Yeah.
07:03	Right.
07:04	%
07:05	This is it. Well, I'm going to tell you something about functional* requirements. Um to start with these points, uh next (??).
07:06	Yeah.
07:10	Mm-hmm.
07:17	Um at first I tell you something about what people dislike about uh the current uh controls, because it's uh a smart thing to exclude those things. Uh, furthermore it's very important what they do like and what they do use.
07:30	# Um then I tell something about um the most important issues so we have to focus on those three thing three things. Um in the end I'll um show you our target # audience or our target product users, customers.
07:48	Well, # um the first findings are that people um
07:54	think most controls are very kind of ug- ugly.
07:58	That's seventy five per cent of the current users, they don't like it, so we might think about fronts in that section, um
08:08	they also say, that's about uh I though it was fifty per cent, that more money will be spent on uh better looking controls, so it's very important that you design a a nice looking control.
08:26	Um the current user uses his machine just about
08:33	Well all of the time for a few functions. Uh, almost every user uses it d- the the control for just ten per cent of (its) capacity so it's very important to make the the buttons for the common uh tasks kind of big or kind of uh flashy.
08:55	Furthermore it's uh # seventy five per cent of the users uh zaps a lot (??) it might be uh might be smart to make a a big uh zapping button or something in the middle so you can reach it with your thumb. Yeah, yeah right.
09:08	You can step away (now).
09:10	$
09:13	Right.
09:14	A lot of losers um users lose their controls $ in their living room, so it might be sensible to make some kind of a button on your television that's your um your control beeps or something that you can find this very easily I dunno, maybe that's an idea, 'cause it's uh a big I think fifty per cent of the users loses his its control within the same room, so -
09:40	It should actually uh - It should actually be loose from the television because it can also be used for other televisions. So if you deliver a small uh click-on device that you can put on your television that bleeps to your uh remote control everyone can use it. No you can click it on your television.
09:42	Yeah.
09:53	Yeah but what if you lose your click on device?
09:57	Yeah but if someone d- somebody else uses it in ano- other room or something.
10:01	$ Yeah in another room, yeah. Well yes.
10:03	^Nei^ but it it it specifically says it's uh the the control is lost in the same room.
10:09	Mm-hmm.
10:10	Yep.
10:10	So
10:12	well beeping device would be uh - furthermore the learning time is a problem. Uh thirty four thirty four per cent um thinks it's it's too uh too difficult to learn so the the learning curve should be very short uh for the dumbest people should be able to use it.
10:12	(No) we'll have a look at it, yeah.
10:31	I think our uh user uh expert should uh also consider manual a manual for the remote of course.
10:37	Yeah but people don't read manuals.
10:39	I didn't (read) it? Oh, alright, (?? users to uh add one?) Do you think?
10:40	No.
10:44	(??)
10:45	I think you should put more time in the in the design of uh pick up and use than a manual.
10:49	Mm-hmm, yeah alright, because they don't use it. Alright.
10:51	You should could take a look at it and and and know how it how it supposed to work.
10:55	Yeah, right.
10:56	(Well there) sh- should always be a menu but it c- can be very short.
10:57	And it should be consistent with consistent with (other) remotes.
10:59	No, but it -
11:01	About a remote control (??)
11:03	Yes okay.
11:04	Well maybe for the - if you don't recognise a button who d- who d- who do I call uh when when I don't know it?
11:04	Alright.
11:09	Yeah right, it sh- it should be there, the manual, but but not to explain how the remote works, only - yeah.
11:14	And we don't have much time, so it's better to uh put our attention to the the design, so you can pick up and use it, than - I think.
11:22	Well we are a design team, we can say to some uh writer uh make a manual, point.
11:26	Yeah alright, right.
11:26	# Isn't it part of the of the u- no, no.
11:27	So-
11:29	Well we'll have a look. Um yes.
11:30	Next point, um, R_S_I_*. Well that's about twenty per cent I thought but uh the designer should uh take it uh $ should uh (^wie zeg ik dat^) yeah, consider the consequences of using your remote, it should be a good in your hand. (??)
11:44	Consider the -
11:49	Mm-hmm.
11:55	Right, this is the most important part. Um, we're - like the requirements said we're gonna specify of we're gonna target a younger audience. Um, that's about sixty per cent of the market so it's uh quite important. Um research shows that they like to have a little L_C_D_ screen on their on their uh zapping uh device, uh -
12:20	I thought it was the age between sixteen and twenty, ninety nine per cent of uh the people like that, so it's very important we should definitely have that in our uh designs.
12:31	Well with twelve Euro fifty as production cost we can't uh afford an L_C_D_ uh -
12:36	Going to be expensive.
12:38	Yeah but # they think it's really important so if we want to s- if we have a big
12:45	# if we makes lots of uh of (the) stuff maybe we can uh buy it very cheap, I dunno. We have to uh -
12:52	Well I will uh consider it uh.
12:53	(Well) yeah well uh it's your your task to uh look into the costs uh of those uh $ (Ni-) I know. $
12:55	We'll think abo- we'll think -
12:58	Yeah, I don't know, I don't have any information on that so uh $
13:00	Ah, we'll look we'll look into that later.
13:02	Alright. And uh another thing is uh speech uh recognition, they also like that but research is very uh costly. So -
13:10	That's uh difficult to realise also.
13:13	Yeah, but
13:15	it # it might be important for the sale.
13:17	We have very demanding clients.
13:18	It's not yet a standard uh development uh those so -
13:19	#
13:21	Oh and we have customers in multiple uh countries I think.
13:22	Well I do think L_C_D_ is more reachable than the speech recognition, so we might consider L_C_D_ screens.
13:22	We sh-
13:26	Yeah absolutely.
13:30	Yeah, yeah, alright. I will consider both and and see what uh what what we can I think. We don't rule them out uh yet.
13:35	Alright.
13:35	Yep.
13:37	(??)
13:38	'Kay.
13:38	Alright. Um, I think that's it, um.
13:43	I think
13:45	it is sensible
13:48	to u- uh to take this take these points into (the) notes so you can - right.
13:54	Well you - I c- I can uh still see your presentation.
13:57	Yeah, right.
13:58	(??) Well uh next um I dunno who is next. You uh got uh -
14:03	(??) you go.
14:03	So I give a technical talk? Alright.
14:04	Yes well go ahead.
14:08	Well uh it is my task to uh explain uh or* to point out a working design.
14:18	And we have that here. (Okay) how do you enlarge it so that you can have the - F_ five.
14:21	F_ five.
14:24	$ F_ five.
14:25	Yep. Well, the working design, that's my uh -
14:26	Oh. $ Next button. $
14:26	$
14:27	$
14:30	Well alright uh, you know who I am and what I do. So uh we have this. It's a bit uh unclear because I wanted to copy paste something. It was originally in black and white but it became black and purple but I think you can read it. Um well um I think it's important* uh for you to (realise) the basic function of a remote control uh well you can see uh -
14:38	Oh right.
14:41	Purple $.
14:43	$
14:43	Yeah, yeah, a bit.
14:52	Maybe you can select it so it uh (inverts).
14:54	Oh yes, so that it -
14:56	And I (then) can select I can select on the ^dings^ (??) goes to the next page.
14:58	(??) the the whole picture. Nah, never mind.
15:02	Well, you can read it, it's not too difficult. (??) this is a schematic uh um view of uh how a basic remote control works. You have uh basically uh the energy, the power of the of the remote control uh and the centre w- which is the left the the the the the the the the the bulb that sends the the infared beam to the (now) to the set,
15:03	Yeah, (go away).
15:25	Yeah.
15:26	(??)
15:27	and uh the source is of course the user uh the user interface is um # uh the # the (??) the buttons of course and the (??) the user interface sends uh the the different signals of the different buttons to the chip, and the chip uh sends it to the LED and the LEd sends it to the receiver, that's the that's the basic idea, very basic.
15:30	#
15:49	Um well (??) I have uh # uh $ put it in a in in in a # a couple of basic steps. Uh the remote uh is basically just weighting for a user to press a key, it does nothing until uh of course uh the key is pressed.
16:05	The (??) the signal to a chip uh the chip sends the connection # uh and recognise the key so # well you understand. The chip uh produces morse code um a specific code to indicate that specific button that is pressed of course, and it uses transistors in the in the remote control to amplify and to send* uh that signal again to the to the LED, which is the bulb, of course.
16:23	#
16:29	(Then) the LED produces an infared beam and signals the - well (it's uh) very simple and signals the uh signals to the sensor on the T_V_ set and the T_V_ set uh also recognises the the # the signal and performs the assigned task.
16:34	Yeah.
16:43	So it is also why we have to um have a button that says uh I'm now busy with a D_V_D_ uh if we('d) had done that, and a button for T_V_, so.
16:50	Ah bu- yeah but we don't uh we $ no no but yeah, exactly. Uh well this is uh the basic uh function of a remote. (??) couple of pictures here, it's a very basic one, and uh (??) if we if we're going to add an uh an uh L_C_D_ screen to it it t- won't look anything like this but
17:00	$
17:09	this is very basic uh basically the the shape of um of a remote control it has uh very little buttons and but it it uh it's it's quite um yeah you can easily recognise the buttons they're* far enough apart and an- (anything) it's not very um
17:26	High tech.
17:26	uh not very high tech uh indeed and not very user friendly uh if you look at the shape (it's uh) just a simple long box uh shape. So we have to change a little bit uh to that uh so that uh it becomes more user friendly and that uh problems like uh R_S_I_* and uh those kinds of thing don't don't oc- don't occur, yeah.
17:43	Right.
17:45	Can I say something? Um I have a table here about uh the l- the relevance of the buttons. Uh the power button is used very much, channel selection, volume and teletext, well teletext is not an option so that uh - but I think it's very important to make um the power, channel and volume buttons uh near to the thumb, so you can't have R_S_I_* consequences.
17:58	Mm-hmm.
18:09	Yeah, because they are the the most important buttons and you can immediately -
18:11	Right, make them big, make them easy to press.
18:14	Well but but # if you have um the most used buttons all in one place, and you keep making the same um well moves, but if y- if you would put it at a different place then you have to move your hands and that's on of the things about R_S_I_*.
18:14	You don't have to look and search for them.
18:16	Right.
18:23	Yeah, right, right.
18:24	I was thinking you can -
18:29	Yeah, that's right, that's right, that's right. We-
18:30	The -
18:32	Well you you can't have any uh every button # under the thumb of course.
18:35	No but the most important buttons m- maybe you can just put them a bit apart so you would
18:36	But -
18:39	Yeah, that's very important, and -
18:42	reject R_* R_S_I_* R_S_I_.
18:43	Maybe you can make for for channel changing two little buttons on the side of the remote so that you can just do like this like some uh little uh Gameboy things or some- hmm?
18:52	Yes I've saw that on m- on mi- mobile telephones they also have uh those buttons.
18:54	But is that is that useable? Do people uh when they pick up a remote know that they have to do that?
19:03	It's a f- it's a new feature, you can make make a double feature l- like a button on the top and under it.
19:03	Well -
19:04	Well it- it's.
19:05	Yeah alright, but -
19:09	Yeah but if you s- say the* up and down they (they'll) understand it (??) I think eighty per cent would.
19:09	Well also i- if someone puts - # picks up his uh remote.
19:15	Well, anyway*.
19:15	If someone puts up i- uh picks up his remote and he (picks it up) but he he touches the side then he's a- already on the next channel. That's very irritating, I think - well. $ No.
19:20	Yeah, he feels it immediately. Yeah, that's right, yeah.
19:22	Yeah that's true.
19:24	Yeah but - #
19:25	Right, continue, sorry. $
19:26	Well then e- in any case the the basic function should be uh indeed and as you say at the thumb, I think that's a good idea, and uh and that the less important uh buttons like the the the different (channels) with the numbers one two three four five as well should be uh yeah well not in reach because uh they don't use it uh all the time.
19:44	Well it's uh pretty* pretty # basically uh as you said and I have some pictures of the inside workings but uh I don't want to get too technical, because uh that's not uh very uh useful for you.
19:45	Yep.
19:51	Mm.
19:54	Yeah that's right. #
19:54	$ That's your part of the job. $
19:55	So yeah exactly well this is uh how it uh looks from the inside, and uh well that's about it I think. Oh yeah, I still have this. Oh I had to delete this but I had to make a schematic uh of the of the new - but I had too too little time but uh don't uh
19:59	Yep.
20:05	Alright.
20:06	$ Okay well we understand, we understand. Oh right, no.
20:07	%
20:09	$
20:11	don't look at it please. I I think it's it's clear uh how it works. Alright, that's the most important thing.
20:12	Alright.
20:13	Yeah, it's clear.
20:17	Nice.
20:18	Alright.
20:18	Then uh Mike can uh give the third presentation.
20:24	Right.
20:24	(How late ?) did we start his presentation. #
20:27	# I dunno, I think uh -
20:30	About twenty minutes ago?
20:31	Yeah.
20:33	Well then we have still the time so. $ (But) we do have to come to a decision.
20:33	Losing time losing time. $
20:38	Yeah right, so -
20:41	So $ (??).
20:41	Mm.
20:41	#
20:45	(Well) I thought um everybody on the website s- uh would see the same thing, but
20:50	(??) think so.
20:51	s- [vocal noise] that's not the case.
20:54	Yeah, uh there are different uh (we have all) have different home pages, with different links, yeah.
20:57	Oh yeah?
20:57	Yeah.
20:58	Yeah right.
20:59	Oh.
20:59	For instance you couldn't see this $.
21:03	$ Okay yeah well.
21:04	Um -
21:06	Yeah. Well I'm (??) user interface design.
21:09	Mm-hmm.
21:11	The the method, well
21:14	I used my own experience with remotes to (??) look uh at the remotes on the corporate website, which are these two. Um -
21:21	Yeah.
21:22	These are already in use.
21:24	Yes these are from from another uh manufacturer, um -
21:27	Alright, okay.
21:30	This one is engineering centered so this one has the most functions and um things. This one is user centered.
21:37	Yeah.
21:37	Mm-hmm.
21:37	Um -
21:38	Well, yeah, me too.
21:38	I'd like (??). $ Yeah.
21:40	I like user centre, centered uh # uh also the best.
21:44	(We also do that.)
21:45	Um -
21:47	Well, I thought uh that we uh reduce the the option to control the D_V_D_ also, and teletext and that kind of stuff.
21:56	Mm.
21:57	Uh so I thought we we we would use more (or*) need more buttons than this one.
22:03	Would we have to reject that, because of the requirements?
22:05	Yes. Th- that's why this mm is not relevant any more I feel, um.
22:06	Yeah.
22:11	Alright.
22:11	$
22:13	I think this is about the maximum number of buttons uh we'll need.
22:17	Yeah, right.
22:18	I um I kinda like the shape, uh I think this is what we talked about.
22:24	Yeah.
22:24	(??) you can't really see uh the differ- from different sides but I think uh -
22:28	(No) I've well (??).
22:31	Uh you can draw it if you - yeah.
22:32	Mm. Oh yeah, I think we should go further with the idea of a removable front, so we can can uh yeah customise the -
22:38	Mm-hmm.
22:40	Well absolutely but i- th- they all have to have something about um the recognition from our company, so we (cannot) just uh
22:47	Mm.
22:50	Yeah f- it's a front it's not the the whole remote that changes of course
22:50	make someone w-
22:53	No but (that's th-) the side they look uh look at is the front. So if y- if you make a a front with just a a tiger on it then uh our recognition is totally gone.
22:54	Would it -
22:54	You can -
22:59	#
23:04	Yeah, that's right.
23:05	Or you can you can can put same symbol on on every remote so l- like Ericson does (diff on) every year.
23:08	Yeah, that's a must, we must have that.
23:10	Well you can put it on the on the back side.
23:12	Yeah well and and -
23:14	S- something like this. # It's recognisable.
23:15	Yes.
23:17	'Kay.
23:18	Um -
23:18	We can make a symbol of the company right here and # if you put a front on it, there's a hole on the front, so the symbol's always on -
23:23	Yeah, so that you don't replace the symbol, yeah.
23:24	Yeah yeah yeah or the th- the the lowest part of the remote isn't changed by the front. Those kind of things, yes. Okay.
23:24	Yeah yeah, something like that in the - yeah.
23:29	Yeah, yeah, but let's not focus on the front (??). $
23:30	Mm-hmm.
23:33	Um well sor- uh like I said I thought we'd (we'd use) more function if we (we had to) include more functions, but we don't, so um -
23:42	Hmm.
23:43	Yeah. I think this is about the maximum number of buttons we need, maybe some less, like eject we don't need and some other buttons we don't need.
23:44	Alright.
23:53	Mike uh can you put uh that picture from me on the - in the (word) documents file, in (map)?
23:57	Yeah, I will. I think (uh for) the remote um uh less is more (??) the less buttons the better the design, um -
24:05	Yeah.
24:05	Yeah, I agree.
24:06	With that concept I think.
24:10	I know.
24:10	Alright.
24:10	I've I've got another point, um, there are two target audi- audiences and we've uh chose for the younger one. Um, research has shown that um it's a high interested uh in features. They are high high interested in feature, but they are more critical. Fo- yeah, more critical. So - the younger audience. So we must um must design uh a control that really speaks to the people.
24:12	Yeah.
24:30	The younger uh -
24:32	Mm-hmm.
24:39	Well what if we um I (at) I at home have a remote that has um the most familiar uh buttons on the top and the bottom side of the front has a little clip*, a f- a little uh - you can click away and then you have f- much more functions that most people don't use but s- some do* do.
24:48	Mm-hmm.
25:01	Mm-hmm. But I think uh the most uh functions uh underneath that uh -
25:06	(Clap) aren't used much.
25:07	They are mm (unusually) -
25:08	Well but because you say they their features are important they want m- um a lot, but not -
25:11	Yeah right.
25:13	Yeah but what kind of features, like L_C_D_ screens and voice recognition, but -
25:14	Yeah I think # m- most -
25:16	Yeah but, yeah.
25:18	Most uh (??).
25:18	Here, look at these numbers, the newest features are like I said are uh L_C_D_ and uh speech uh control.
25:26	Our audience, these people, are very, like these uh features, you see? So we must build in something or they will to uh go to the ^concurrent^ $, competitors, right. # So, I do think we have to uh have some features
25:32	Mm-hmm.
25:38	Uh c- $ competitors. $
25:38	Yeah. Our competitor, yeah.
25:41	$
25:47	Yeah. Well maybe w- we could uh (??) on um some uh calculators you have lo- those little little L_C_D_ (th-) that you can click on or something (or that you can) click uh out uh of the remote and if if that's gives you a little bit of sta- (status) information. Yeah.
25:47	even though they cost a little more.
25:55	Right, right.
26:03	Like a (ticker-tape). Which programme you are l- watching or something.
26:07	Yeah, that's (nice and -)
26:07	Those kind of things uh because you also have those uh those program recognition for your V_ V_C_R_s.
26:14	And uh well if y- if your remote picks that up also you they can display which programme you're currently watching.
26:14	Yeah right (??).
26:15	Yeah.
26:20	Yeah, so it it just signals the the different uh sig- uh the different symbols on the screen you have uh because if you change to s- channel two you have two on the screen and two on your on your um on your L_C_D_ screen (??).
26:33	For example
26:35	it it could be (such) a little uh th- that you can click in and out and you and you have it.
26:40	Yeah, we should keep that simple too.
26:42	But should it uh really be uh clickable, uh -
26:45	No not clickable. Nah, no no no. Yeah, just at, at the top. So when you s- # sit like this you can (??) can watch. I think it should be at the top.
26:45	Well maybe.
26:46	No, it should be integrated.
26:48	Just integrate inside to try to make it d- more -
26:53	Yeah, something like on um some radios in car - you - where it's yeah, walking.
26:59	Yeah right, it's a (ticker-tape) idea.
26:59	R_D_S_(s) (or) something.
27:02	But that's of course a a bit more uh expensive than uh the basic uh calculator design, with the scrolling text and (??) that kind of thing.
27:10	[vocal noise]
27:10	Well it's just one script. #
27:10	Well I think it's you got - (it just means it's a script that's uh) keeps it uh rolling and it's not uh - that's five minutes off uh implementing time I think uh.
27:18	Yeah, five minutes of ^ja, ja^ for programming. So I don't think that's the issue.
27:21	Yeah.
27:23	No.
27:24	Alright.
27:24	Alright, we go with the L_C_D_ screen?
27:26	Uh well I think so, yes. Um -
27:27	# Yeah (although?) we we we still need to know how much that will cost.
27:28	'Kay.
27:32	Right, I don't know if I can find that, but -
27:33	we're g- no (??). We'll have to look into that.
27:34	Or maybe you will get that information uh -
27:37	Next time, yeah right.
27:37	Um we can use this board again, I think. Uh we can put some um decisions about um the controls we want th- the issue (??). # Where is my presentation? $ Uh.
27:51	Yeah, (understand what) -
27:53	(??)
27:55	Uh.
27:58	We should have a general idea of how it's gonna look.
28:03	Well.
28:04	(??) We're all* here now, I think. These I've already given you, so we have to decide on the different remote control functions.
28:14	Right.
28:14	So we want to have a small L_C_D_ screen that's special.
28:17	(??).
28:20	Shouldn't we start with the most important parts, the L_C_D_ screen - oh alright (??) we (should) start with the power button uh -
28:22	Yeah.
28:22	Or at the bottom.
28:24	I think the top is more uh -
28:26	Yeah.
28:27	When you z- how do you zap? You just sit in your chair
28:31	Huh?
28:32	with the remote.
28:32	#
28:32	With the L_C_D_ screen on the top it gets a bit unnatural, 'cause most remotes have some space left at the bottom.
28:34	That thing is terrible.
28:40	Yeah but that's where your hand (ball) might be. Yeah, I dunno.
28:42	Uh.
28:43	Yeah, (not) mm.
28:45	And then uh
28:46	We'll draw two, (??).
28:48	maybe we should uh centralise the discussion here, (y-) I dunno what uh you were talking about but -
28:51	No, $ um, he thinks yeah right, he thinks it's better to put uh L_C_D_ at the bottom, and I think it's better at the top.
28:54	(??)
29:01	Uh-huh. Why do you think it's better at the bottom?
29:04	Uh well because most uh remotes have um some space left at the bottom, and that way you can keep the shape recognisable for everybody.
29:12	(??).
29:13	But you just can put uh the the the the the whole interface a bit down so that there's -
29:17	Yeah. The the ticker- the L_C_D_ is like like small. # It's it's (wide), it's not not high, but # -
29:17	(Well I d-) I think that's that's ugly but -
29:18	For the for the interface.
29:23	Uh-huh.
29:24	Well I th- I think Mike Mike has a point because um when when uh when I use a remote I l- I hate the buttons* but- buttons at the at the bottom. So and and I I like to use the ones
29:25	I've f-
29:27	Hmm. Power button always mm.
29:33	Bottom.
29:34	Mm.
29:35	(Y- you) gotta a shape like this you want to -
29:38	on the top, so, when I u- when I have (to have an) L_C_D_ (scr- window) -
29:38	Yeah alright, but -
29:40	Well (??). Well, I agree with you (??) -
29:41	We're making a remote with #
29:45	with a few functions you know. We-
29:46	It's it's also more recognisable, it looks more like a calculator to people if you have the l- the the
29:53	#
29:54	Yes but w- w- we we don't want that. We don't want them to look like a calculator we want to look it like our original but familiar -
29:54	the thing on top. $
29:56	Yeah you don't want - you want uh yeah it it it must be a remote.
30:01	Yeah w- well but uh you don't have to throw uh um important aspe- # important aspect like familiarity uh completely away uh because # I think it's uh -
30:05	High tech (??). #
30:06	$ Yea-
30:09	#
30:10	Maybe a bic- uh better uh white uh - # we- white.
30:13	I think it's still important to have it at the top because it's uh
30:14	We-
30:15	(??) Line width* width.
30:18	(??) that's not a problem i- when I draw here it oh, huh?
30:18	it's more familiar that way.
30:23	It's a bit off. Well. $
30:24	Yeah, it's off.
30:25	A little a little bit.
30:26	# It # needs to be calibrated again.
30:28	Well uh let's uh talk about that later uh. $
30:29	$
30:30	Maybe you (??) maybe that's uh better.
30:33	Where?
30:33	(??) you e- you only have one pen for that screen, yeah.
30:34	It's special pen.
30:35	Alright, we have to make a decision now, because we don't have much time, um -
30:37	Yeah. No.
30:41	I think we have uh a few functions and we can put uh the L_C_D_ above it, and still have lots of room at the bottom where you can put your hand.
30:48	Yeah.
30:50	I think it should be at the bottom* bottom.
30:51	At the bottom. In in in a few minutes oh yeah oh yeah, I totally agree, yeah.
30:52	Well I am the # I am the designer so um $ -
30:52	Bottom, the L_C_D_.
30:54	At the bot-
30:56	Yeah.
30:56	So -
30:58	We're two V_S_ two. $
30:59	Well but (uh) what what if we we first decide the different functions and then look at the design, because we have to decide this.
31:01	He's the boss.
31:04	Yeah.
31:04	Right, great.
31:05	Uh we yeah we were busy with that uh yeah well we should uh (summon) the the different uh aspects of the thing. So, we have the power button.
31:09	Yeah.
31:12	And moreover I think that you two should be uh come to consensus about the L_C_D_ s- uh your it's your job. $
31:19	Yeah of course yeah it's uh (yeah*).
31:19	Oh it's our job.
31:20	Well we have a power button. Guys -
31:22	(While) you have to agree I can say (??) it's like this and # you must agree, yeah.
31:23	Yeah, right*.
31:25	Guys - $ We have a power button, setting buttons, L_C_D_ window, the number buttons -
31:25	Alright, let's keep it central.
31:29	With ten numbers, yeah.
31:31	Channel, yeah.
31:32	#
31:34	Volume.
31:34	Volume control.
31:35	Yes.
31:38	Um. #
31:41	Mm.
31:42	Well let's look at your design.
31:43	The mute button. I love that one.
31:46	$
31:48	Uh-huh.
31:49	I think we we should use something like this um to um -
31:55	The the channel up and channel down button # (??) circle you know.
31:57	Yes.
31:59	#
31:59	Yeah (yeah yeah yeah) well that's that's also design.
32:01	And and a volume control also in it.
32:03	Yes.
32:05	Right.
32:06	Um.
32:07	Next p- uh. But th- th- on this remote th- these controls are for something else, a D_V_D_ player or something, so -
32:08	Well h- ho-
32:12	Yes yes they are for some uh video uh -
32:13	As I s- I already said, we could drop some of these buttons, mm -
32:16	You should put that uh power button, channel and volume should have the most uh importance.
32:22	Yeah.
32:24	I think these should be in one big circle in the middle.
32:27	Yeah, but what he said about R_S_I_*.
32:30	Was oh t- (kinda true) when (??) when you uh put them all in the same place the most used buttons, you're doing the same thing all the time, and that's just what R_S_I_*'s all about, so it might be smarter to put them a little more away from each other.
32:50	Apart.
32:52	So people have to move their hands, and they get less uh complaints of R_S_I_.
32:58	Yeah it's it's also not good to completely stay in one position constantly with one hand y-
33:01	(??)
33:02	That's what I always do because all my i- important buttons are on the same place.
33:03	Yeah. It's good to move uh from time time yeah.
33:06	Yeah but people don't like it when their buttons are all over the place, they they need to be centered.
33:06	Um -
33:10	No but now you w- would we have to uh choose a
33:11	Well not -
33:14	Frequency of uh button use, um channels are uh most uh is most used within the hour. You can see, so the the # channel uh channel buttons should be far far apart, I think, up and down.
33:15	(??) middle.
33:16	Yes.
33:17	$
33:22	Uh-huh.
33:23	Volume (hardly).
33:32	No I don't think.
33:33	# Oh. Far apart?
33:33	Up and down far apart from each other.
33:35	# You thinking about R_S_I_*.
33:39	Well not too much. $
33:39	L- look at uh look at the frequency. ^Nei^ not too much, but -
33:41	$
33:44	(??) the other the other two uh frustrations are far more important, so -
33:48	I think you can have the two buttons of up and down close together, but you don't have uh have to have volume control and and zapping button close together.
33:54	Well for example the power button, you can -
33:57	(Or they are used for.)
33:58	(Well if) someone is constantly z- zapping (he's) not going to miss that (it) that the power button is not right beside it because I have (someone ??). So that one can be put away.
34:05	^Nei nei nei^ n- I I total agree, but just -
34:09	Yeah, right.
34:11	Yeah. I agree.
34:11	The power button can uh - be uh uh -
34:14	Power bu- button should be left at the top.
34:16	Yes oh man, five minutes. $
34:16	And should and should be red.
34:22	Yeah, well five minutes left. Yep.
34:23	Alright, just make some decision.
34:26	The most important things we have to uh -
34:28	Um how are we going to do it with those numbers?
34:29	K- k- can you make you make - we can use uh the drawing board now I think yeah it it doesn't work well but it it would be pretty pretty uh nice if we could just draw a simple thing.
34:34	Well I have it here.
34:38	I do think you have to keep you have to keep it central now, just uh you decide that, you decide that and # ready.
34:39	Yeah well that's going to take too too much time. Yes.
34:42	Yeah.
34:44	Yes.
34:44	Alright.
34:46	Well the L_C_D_ um you are Industrial, you are User Interface so I think it's going to go to Mike, but you will have to make a consensus with (??) well -
34:54	Yeah.
35:00	(??) consensus um we we can put it in the middle, so -
35:01	Well it's a bit hard because we are going to be uh individually. That's a bit uh
35:02	^Nei^ we're, no -
35:04	We're deciding now, so.
35:06	Yes.
35:08	Top or bottom?
35:09	Well yeah, I I still think it's it's quite important though uh to have it at the top so yeah. You say familiarity isn't important but # -
35:13	Yes it is.
35:18	Well what if we're going to now decide about the functions and the design comes into the next round.
35:25	Okay.
35:25	Plus the d- th- the design round is still to come eh?
35:26	Yeah.
35:28	Yeah, right, okay.
35:29	Alright.
35:29	Alright these functions, the number f- well yes, that's alright. W- the number function, are we going to uh do it like uh on Mike's screen with uh one button that says I'm going to do a t- two number digital?
35:30	(As) we we we we agreed we do have a L_C_D_ so that's
35:33	Yeah, okay.
35:35	that's enough, yeah.
35:43	No.
35:45	How do you want it to do then?
35:47	That's one two three four five six six seven eight nine zero.
35:47	When you push a one one and -
35:48	It it has to r- recognise one as # there could still come more.
35:53	No # if you - on most T_V_s if you uh press two numbers shortly after each other # d- it - yeah.
35:54	Oh, like that um.
35:58	Yes.
35:59	They'd recognise it. Th- that's the most, that that's very easy. Yeah.
36:00	Alright so no button for that.
36:02	No.
36:04	Okay uh anyone any (one) oth- other functionalities of our uh remote?
36:10	I think these are the the most important functions.
36:12	Do you still have the pictures over there?
36:13	Yeah.
36:14	So -
36:21	Yeah, it's (??).
36:25	You do need uh uh (??) or did we - no, like this one. You do need them? Yeah, I know, but are we -
36:31	No we'd of just said we didn't uh -
36:35	Alright, alright uh $ (now) okay.
36:35	# Well uh - $
36:38	# Um well because we can't integrate it with any other uh remotes all those buttons on those pictures are uh irrelevant. So just for a television is # all we need.
36:46	Right.
36:50	Yeah, it's most useable this way.
36:53	(??) basic function.
36:55	Teletext is gone, so all those buttons that # ar- are to do with teletext - oh screen placing.
36:59	#
37:02	We'll have uh those uh buttons about uh -
37:05	#
37:06	And uh there's two important ones we're l- f- forgetting. Uh there's (??) screen, you can make it wider and less wide, and the button that you can go to (??) for your video.
37:12	Yeah.
37:16	Right. I do think we have to put that underneath a (clap).
37:20	Those two, but it's just two, and we make (a clip).
37:21	Uh a just two* just two (??).
37:24	That's a bit uh waste.
37:24	We we can make # make uh a little row of like four buttons down here.
37:28	Yes.
37:29	Yeah, okay, right.
37:30	Or at the top. $ Your L_C_D_ screen* is going to go. $
37:30	Think uh -
37:33	But you you can put uh two or three buttons under uh another section uh, that's that's too complicated you can just put it somewhere they they aren't used much, not as much as those other, so you can put it somewhere -
37:33	Yeah alright (??).
37:38	Yes.
37:43	No, they can be smaller, round like -
37:45	Yeah s- bit smaller and s- well uh and and I think more at the bottom, yeah.
37:53	Yeah or at the top yeah, what do you think um those those buttons, above or down?
37:56	Well I think they should in an in an isolated part of the remote.
38:00	And w- where? Well we design it later. We have it, and we design later where everything goes, yeah.
38:05	Yes yes, well any other uh -
38:09	Well if you if you you take those th- if you -
38:10	Who go to video?
38:12	Go to video, that's always on your remote control. To (??) uh to (??). A_V_.
38:15	Yeah but you can z- you can zap t- you can you zap to the video channel from zero to uh -
38:17	The the video channel, uh.
38:20	Yeah.
38:21	Well l- n- no- not at not at my remote.
38:21	No no not always. Ze- yeah zero is a different channel than uh the the video channel.
38:24	Yeah.
38:25	Yeah, but you can can zap -
38:26	Yeah, but when you zap down zero you get to A_V_*.
38:29	Yes, I think they -
38:29	I don't. I go to ninety-nine. $
38:31	No it would - then you press ninety nine, I think go to video is
38:32	# Whatever, #.
38:36	an irrelevant button, but -
38:36	Th- that's the button uh. (No.)
38:37	But it's easy to go (??) # if you are at uh at channel uh fifty five and you want to uh go immediately to the video channel you do you have to push a- to to get below zero, it's more easy to get to where where the speficic uh video channel button.
38:47	No you can ch- push zero, yeah. Yeah I I think that one button is uh - I use it uh -
38:53	Yeah but if we're choosing to uh incorporate these buttons you have to have uh channel setting, if you wa- if you have a new T_V_, you have to set the channels, right all th- these uh different buttons you have to -
39:01	Yeah.
39:04	(These) buttons I don't have buttons for channel setting especially on my remote.
39:08	Ah, (I do) #.
39:09	Yeah well uh d- different screen settings # yeah -
39:09	It's it's incorporated with p- m- plus and down, uh those -
39:13	Yeah y- you you you you have screen with -
39:13	Yeah yo- yeah you have one one button from # s- set (free ??) and then with plus and min- minus you can uh adjust the uh -
39:21	Alright. That's the only one we put uh in there.
39:26	So we still (??) have one uh four.
39:29	For a screen uh fu- uh channel setting.
39:32	Yeah to uh oh yeah of course to configure the - to programme the, yeah.
39:34	Programme, right.
39:35	Okay oh the okay button. $ Oh you always have in the centre and okay button for your menu. Menu button.
39:38	Uh -
39:42	Yeah.
39:42	Alright.
39:45	You should, yeah. I think that's important, uh (??) and and the settings to change the brightness # the settings to change the brightness and the contrast.
39:47	Channel setting menu (??). We have to go.
39:51	# Uh.
39:54	Okay.
39:54	Channel, yeah.
39:56	(??).
39:56	So um save.
39:58	Chief?
40:00	Chief.
40:01	Yes see.
40:02	The menu* menu button is also important, then you can uh -
40:04	Yes I have put it in.
40:05	Where? $ I don't see it. Oh menu, alright.
40:08	Here.
40:09	I think things like uh contrast and brightness should be um in the menu yeah.
40:09	$
40:13	#
40:13	In the menu. And you can uh then adjust it with the zapping buttons or something. Because uh the zapping buttons aren't used then if you are in the menu, yeah, or the volume, yeah.
40:18	Yeah, the -
40:19	Alright.
40:20	Or the volume or something like that.
40:22	Guys we're going to uh go to our uh rooms and uh we'll have to decide some things on our own I think.
40:26	Your pen.
40:27	Ah. Great.
40:29	Yes chief.
40:30	$
40:32	Alright.
40:33	(??) lunch uh right now or not?
40:33	Well see you uh - w- w- we have lunchtime, by the way, now uh so uh -
40:34	Yeah this is # this is your thing.
40:36	Yeah, lunchbreak.
40:37	Okay, (??).
40:37	I am hungry. $
40:38	Lunch.
40:39	$ (??) into my belly. $
40:41	$
40:42	We didn't exactly do everything but - $
40:46	^??.^
40:48	See you later mate. #
40:56	Hmm?

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